Sounds like you have a gun control position kind of like the cops I know. They just don't think anybody should have a gun, and people shouldn't be packing heat.

I'm not a fan of the gun industry; the US is a huge exporter of small arms, as you allude to re: Mexico cartels.

Statistically, owning a gun makes one more likely to get shot, for the obvious reason that the risk of self-injury is higher, and most gunfire incidents are inadvertent.

Why do you own the 9mm if you don't use it?

I'm not a policeman, but its interesting you said that.  You are right, of course. Guns have to be handled with respect. I haven't used the pistol much as I just don't seem to find the time. I am an amateur astronomer, built a telescope, haven't used it in years. Someday I'll find time for my hobbies. A computer....is a lazy hobby. You never have to leave the house.

Obama has given up (for the time being) on getting any "assault weapon" bill passed.

 

As proven by the gun grabbing governments of England, Canada and Australia, gun bans have very little effect on crime prevention. In fact, taking away firearms from citizens causes an increase in crime!

 

Surprisingly, your statement is very similar to that made by Hillary recently - i suggest you read my recent post about "assault weapons" having sporting uses.

 

I don't know if you saw the picture of some of the weapons captured from Mexican drug gangs, but grenades, M79 Grenade launchers & ammo are not items stocked by your average gun dealer! As for fully auto weapons - there are damned few dealers willing to go through the hassle involved with being a Class III dealer. The majority of full auto weapons run in the $5,000 - $20,000 range... I don't know about you, but I sure as hell can't afford that... and an hour on the range... with most quality ammo going for $1.00/round... $100/min - easily!

 

Requiring handguns to be registered serves no useful purpose other than making it easier for the government to take them away... it worked VERY WELL for Nazi Germany!!

And NEVER say "It can't happen here" - because it could!!!

 

As I've believed for decades - we don't need more gun control - we need more CRIME CONTROL!

I agree with almost all of what you are saying. Prohibiting firearms in general (like Britain and Mexico) never reduces crime. Criminals will always get firearms, as proven in the UK where private firearms are virtually prohibited. Canada allows people to own handguns and rifles, however automatic weapons and assault weapons are considered illegal. Canadians need to have a permit to buy any firearm, and handguns are registered. Crime with firearms is still relatively low there.  Almost every handgun used by criminals there is smuggled in from the US, according to their police agencies. That is interesting, when you think about our other border - Mexico, where gun ownership is even stricter than Canada's.

I don't believe in taking away people's firearms, if they commit a felony that might be an option, depending on the crime. You're right, the Mexican cartels don't get all their weapons from the US, and RPGs and Uzis are not originating at Frank's Gun store in Phoenix. But a lot of their weaponry is coming from the US, according to the Mexican government. I can't imagine hunting anything with an assault rifle, and I really don't understand why ordinary citizens need them. I think they constitute a danger in the hands of kooks, crooks, and teens. Ordinary police do not stand a chance against these weapons. Guess we differ there. I will read your post about them though.

I don't worry about the government confiscating handguns. A registry would make that easier, but would prove ineffective as a confiscation tool as there are so many in circulation already, and few would  register them. The 2A is a fundamental right that any sane politician would avoid messing with, and I think your fears are unfounded. If the country every degenerates to the point where it goes after people's handguns, then we're finished as a nation, like
Germany was. I just can't see that happening.

" ...I can't imagine hunting anything with an assault rifle... "

 

Well, of the 4 weapons I own that I referenced in my post, ( 98K Mauser, Spanish 1916 Mauser, Norinco SKS and US M1 Carbine ) all are perfectly suited for deer hunting, with the exception of the SKS because it is equiped with a bayonet - which, if I removed it, would then be "legal" to hunt with. Yes, I have HiCap magazines but  for most of my magazine-fed weapons, but I also have LowCap which are more suitable for hunting. The 98K and 1916 Mausers are very well suited for long-range, open-land shooting... what prevents me from using them is their weight - at nearly 10 pounds each, they become quite burdensome after 8 hours of stomping through the woods... a nice 5.5 - 6 pound weapon isn't nearly as tiresome and a 3 pound handgun is even less so.

 

I've read how well the Canadian gun ban has fared... I believe it was up to 80% NON-compliance in some providences! Apparently, they're taking after their American Cousins... " ...when they pry it from my cold dead hands... "   

 

" If the country every degenerates to the point where it goes after people's handguns... "

Are you forgetting Katrina?

How about Washington DC?

How about NYC?

Have you forgotten "Presidential Signing Statements"?

 

Those, who really are in charge of this nation (and world) are the ones who dictate "Policy"... Presidents are nothing more than sock puppets for "Them"!  No I'm not talking about the 1954 Sci-Fi classic... but Them as in the TriLateral Commission, The World Bank, The Council on Foreign Relations, The Fed., and the Bilderberg Group... the true powers running this country and the world!!

If They tell Obama to start grabbing guns, he will. He and most of his entire staff/appointees are anti-gun. All it takes is a Presidential Signing Statement and the AG would be all over it like stink on s**t.

 

Here's a list of Agencies under control of the AG:

 

ATF, DEA, FBI, Bureau of Prisons, US Marshals Service, Office of the Inspector General

 

No one ever said politicians were sane - Dubya pretty well proved that, as did Hitler, Idi Amin & Papa Doc. 

 

BTW, most police departments have full automatic or selective fire weapons... they can get them from the military - I believe for free... my local PD also has a "Body Bunker" capable of stopping a 20mm round!  Know anyone with a 20mm cannon?  Me neither!

 

I'd rather be judged by twelve than carried by six.

 

"Gun control has cleared the way for seven major genocides since 1915, in which governments gone bad murdered 56,000,000 persons, including millions of children."
-Aaron Zelman of Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership

 

"Americans have the right and advantage of being armed - unlike the citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms. "
James Madison, The Federalist Papers

 

The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it.
Thomas Jefferson

 

 

I agree, a heavy weapon is a pain to hunt with. I hunted deer with a Remington .308 many years ago.  Semi-automatic with a nice bushnell scope, a pleasure to carry and use.

I think we have fundamentally different views about government. You have little or no faith in the US gov't. No need to really say more there.  We both agree on our right to bear arms. I don't think the founding fathers of this country would endorse private individuals owning the type of firepower I am opposed to. Firearms were muskets when the constitution was written. Police responding to a domestic dispute (with handguns), faced with some nut with a military assault rife don't have a chance. By the time the SWAT team arrives with their firepower, the cops are dead, the family is dead, and the jerk has shot himself. Happens all the time. That is what I am concerned about.

I don't think that gun control had anything to do with the millions of Jews from Poland that were exterminated. That's where most of the Jews came from. Do you really think the Jews in Germany would fight the SS and SA with small arms? European society never had a gun culture. That is something unique to the US. The American Revolution spawned it, and that was understandable. To say that gun control in Deutschland cleared the way for genocide is over the top.

Anyway, I appreciate your opinions. I have met men who share your appraisal of our government, their suspicion that sinister agencies are manipulating it. Always interesting. There is more going on than people know, I'll give you that.

Isn't it nice that we can have opposing views and still have an intelligent discussion without reverting to name calling? I wish there was more of it here.

 

After 17+ years in dispatching fire & police, I can say without hesitation, that the most feared call was a domestic violence call... not the 8 car pile-up with injuries, not the 3 story building fully involved, not even the man with a gun... but the husband/wife - bf/gf fighting. If any "simple" call can go to hell on a fast freight; that's it. More than one patrolman has had it bite him on the ass. And for the most part assault weapons are not a factor, more often than not, it's a common hunting rifle or shotgun.

 

Ya know... up until Watergate, I had a fairly positive view of our government, but that just seemed to mark the beginning of the slow slide into depravity it's reached today. Hell, at one time, I liked the Republican Party! Again, you can thank Nixon for changing that.

 

But thanks to the Internet I'm able to do more research into what's really going on in this country and proud not to be one of the mindless sheeple who blindly trust and believe the propaganda spewed by the talking heads and government controlled media. I also must thank one individual who drummed into our vacant heads, almost daily, the concept of "GET THE FACTS!" - my 12th Grade Problems of American Democracy teacher. It has served me well these many years! 

 

Hmmm... there's something I'll have to research - the European firearms culture. I know the British were avid hunters and shooters at one time. They're responsible for many of the big bore game rifles currently in production due to their African safari hunts.

 

I do however believe that Jefferson, Washington, Franklin, etc. would be impressed with current firearms - militar & civilian... and perhaps, drool a little... Imagine the American "rebels" armed with semi-auto or even bolt action firearms with metalic cartridges vs the British armed with flintlocks. The Revolution would have been a matter of months instead of years. No, I believe the evolution of firearms was in the minds of the brilliant men (Jefferson) when they drafted the Constitution and Bill of Rights - the men were great visionaries.

There is an interesting article in the NY Times you may want to look at:

http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2009/04/14/us/0414GUNS_index.html

Regards
GD

Thanks for the link.

 

Hey, here's a thought... How about Mexico does something!  Anything!  Other than piss & moan about the trafficing of firearms from the US!!

For the most part, the US and it's licensed firearms dealers are doing their part... a dishonest dealer doesn't last very long here.

What has Mexico done?

Whine, piss and moan about America being the fault of Mexicans trafficing guns!

That's about the same mentallity as those who blame the woman for getting raped!!

Seriously, do you see Mexico doing anything to curtail it's second largest cash crop (The first place goes to Mexican Illegal Aliens sending their ill-gotten gains back to Mexico) - drug industry?

 

" The Mexican foreign minister, Patricia Espinosa, in talking with reporters recently, accused the United States of violating its international treaty obligations by allowing guns to flow into the hands of organized crime groups in Mexico. "

 

PURE, UNADULTERATED, BULLSHIT!

 

Mexico just doesn't have the balls to own-up that the responsibility is THEIRS!

That THEY have failed!

Or more exact - THEY HAVEN'T EVEN TRIED!!

 

Ya know, there are probably a few hundred thousand Veterans and honest firearms owners, who know how and are willing to act, to simplisticly solve the problem... a live, well armed "fence" with high-power, scoped hunting rifles across the entire US - Mexico border.

Nope, nope, nope... we don't need any "assault weapons" to do the job, just our trusty deer/elk/moose huntin' rifle!!    

You are completely right, it is lame to hear the Mexicans throw shit at the US for "allowing guns"  to be smuggled into its country. As a sovereign state, it is the responsibility of Mexican government to maintain control of its borders, and what crosses them.

What I think we need to do is physically inspect everything crossing the Mexican border (both ways). This should be done by the US as there is rampant corruption by the Mexican police and authorities. A Berlin-style wall should be built along the entire US-Mexican border. This would also stop the flood of illegal migrants, a major problem we all know about. The current Homeland Security secretary, Napolitano, is a complete idiot who is totally unqualified for her job. She might be able to run a day care for preschoolers.

The excuse we're given by politicians like her is that its too expensive or not feasible. Bullshit. If we can deploy hundreds of thousands of troops to Iraq and spend hundreds of billions there, then we surely can redeploy a fraction of those resources to the border area. The drug cartels cannot survive long if we choke them off.

Unfortunately, the Mexicans are incapable controlling their internal affairs right now, and cannot be depended on for anything. Numerous senior officials in the Mexican government are working for the cartels. Several years ago a Mexican warship was smuggling drugs. Typical third world country stuff. The US has to step up and do something.

Obama had better get a grip soon, or he'll have a failed state on his border.

Hell, I knew we could reach a common denominator! 

 

Congress has appropriated millions of USD's for the construction of a border wall, but somewhere between the available funds and the actual construction, there's been a large vacancy... the job just isn't getting done.

 

I totally agree about Napolitano... just what we need - another lawyer in charge that don't know shit about the J-O-B! What we need is a Constitutional Amendment banning lawyers from holding public office(s) - except as judges! If the religious right doesn't do this country in, it will be the lawyers that do it for sure!!

 

Hopefully, Obama will have the balls to tell the Mexicans outright it's THEIR problem - deal with it!

 

We'll see soon enough...

The nature of the right to bear arms protects my right as a law-abiding citizen to own any arm that I choose.  The definition of "arms" as it was in use by the founders is the only limit to our 2A rights, specifically that we have the right to own any man-portable weapon that any foot infantry would be expected to carry, because the right to bear arms is meant to create a citizenry that can stand as a militia both in defense of the nation and in resistance against the professional armies of home-grown tyrants.

Somehow I don't feel threatened by the possibilitity of u using these guns in a harmful manner.

 

But the 250 million other people out there? that is a different story.

I was born and raised in Texas and served in the Navy for 6 years. I will be damned if someone takes my guns away. Now I understand about having true gun control in that it should be harder to own them but if people want to hunt or have protection then they should be able too.


Debt Solutions

My concern is keeping them out of the hands of the wrong people.
I think we could do a better job there. I am against confiscation, and support the right to bear arms for self protection, and sport.